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The Jordan Peterson thread
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Aboulia Offline
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Post: #3626
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(02-18-2020 09:17 AM)Blaster Wrote:  Why do so many people waste such an immense amount of time and energy on ad hominem attacks on Peterson? I get bringing it up. It's news worth acknolwedging, it's worth learning from public failures. But all this gloating and mountains of text devoted to continued attacks and womanish gossip just reinforces the argument that you never understood his message in the first place or why it mattered.

Hypocrisy matters when the hypocrite benefits at the expense of the audience. Preaching austerity when you engage in gluttony enabled by the austerity you preach: that's hypocrisy. Diversity for thee, not for me. That is hypocrisy. Making mistakes is just being human. If you preach the virtues of BJJ for self-defense then get your ass kicked in a fight, that doesn't mean you were wrong it just means you are weak or even just unlucky.

Peterson presents formidable and well-reasoned arguments for his ideas and promotes questioning and criticism. It's a very bad sign if your counter-argument is dominated by attacks on petty personal shortcomings, with the occasional disingenuous attack on some failure to provide a simple enough answer to a question that maybe isn't as simple as you imagine it to be. It's a bad sign even if you're capable of generating an entire book's worth of personal criticism. It's still just personal criticism and what matters are the ideas.

Well reasoned isn't "I'm going to put everyone to the right of me in a box, and everyone in that box is out of the conversation", it's arguments in an echo chamber. Once you do that, you disregard truth, even by his own standards since it's controlling the outcome. He portrayed himself as a warrior for free speech, and for truth. Which you cannot be if you restrict some people from talking due to their political leaning thus controlling the debate to determine the outcome.

Come to think of it, some of the vitriol he gets is from people realizing they've been decieved by someone who wasn't who he said he was, some of that is going to manifest as an emotional outburst in anger in some people, and why wouldn't people be angry at being deceived?

(02-18-2020 04:30 PM)Bitter End Wrote:  Do we have any good trees left online?

My personal favourite is Dr. Johnson. He's a rebel academic. Here's a paper on Plato's Gorgias which is directly relevant to this topic
https://www.rusjournal.org/wp-content/up...orgias.pdf
(This post was last modified: 02-18-2020 08:20 PM by Aboulia.)
02-18-2020 08:17 PM
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Sherman Offline
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Post: #3627
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
It also doesn't matter what his life is like, all that matters is ideas and discourse.
[/quote]

A bad tree cannot produce good fruit.
[/quote]

But that would imply everything he said is garbage or flat out wrong. Clearly that's not the case.

If a liar says something they believe untrue but it turns out to be correct, does that mean what he said is still wrong anyway?

[quote='Bitter End' pid='2060660' dateline='1582061454']

The problem is how do you know what is correct? The reality is that your false ego evaluates a statement and thinks it's correct. But this is not reliable. That is why it is useful to have a a trusted guide outside your ego that can point you to the truth. My meditation instructor was once asked how do you find a good meditation instructor? He said, notice what happens if someone takes his shoes. In other words, if he is for real, he will have a stable and calm mind under every circumstance. This is called equanimity. Jordan Peterson’s mind is a tempest resonating at the lowest frequencies. And he takes dangerous drugs that pushes him from instability into the hell realms. How can someone with this clouded consciousness guide someone else to have a stable mind? Don’t entrust your soul to a fool.

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02-18-2020 08:33 PM
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MichaelWitcoff Offline
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Post: #3628
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
Peterson is essentially a Laveyan materialist, even if he lacks the terminology to describe himself as such, who has stated that truth can be defined as whatever helps you survive and reproduce. He is now at the end of that path and the Hell it creates in the mind and soul of the person who lives that way, but God has found many people at exactly such a low point in their lives. He needs prayer, and lots of it.

Jewish convert to Orthodox Christianity and best-selling author of "On The Masons And Their Lies."
(This post was last modified: 02-18-2020 08:42 PM by MichaelWitcoff.)
02-18-2020 08:37 PM
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Batman_ Offline
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Post: #3629
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(02-18-2020 08:33 PM)Sherman Wrote:  The problem is how do you know what is correct? The reality is that your false ego evaluates a statement and thinks it's correct. But this is not reliable. That is why it is useful to have a a trusted guide outside your ego that can point you to the truth. My meditation instructor was once asked how do you find a good meditation instructor? He said, notice what happens if someone takes his shoes. In other words, if he is for real, he will have a stable and calm mind under every circumstance. This is called equanimity. Jordan Peterson’s mind is a tempest resonating at the lowest frequencies. And he takes dangerous drugs that pushes him from instability into the hell realms. How can someone with this clouded consciousness guide someone else to have a stable mind? Don’t entrust your soul to a fool.

Well, obviously there is such a thing as objective truth, and if you base the truth of a statement on your opinion of speaker, then you're making a big mistake.

There was a meditation guru who requested his students bring him ice cream with walnuts and would convince the men to let him sleep with their wives. Doesn't mean he couldn't meditate to enlightment and see every illusionary layer of the ego.

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(This post was last modified: 02-18-2020 09:58 PM by Batman_.)
02-18-2020 09:53 PM
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Sherman Offline
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Post: #3630
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(02-18-2020 09:53 PM)Batman_ Wrote:  
(02-18-2020 08:33 PM)Sherman Wrote:  The problem is how do you know what is correct? The reality is that your false ego evaluates a statement and thinks it's correct. But this is not reliable. That is why it is useful to have a a trusted guide outside your ego that can point you to the truth. My meditation instructor was once asked how do you find a good meditation instructor? He said, notice what happens if someone takes his shoes. In other words, if he is for real, he will have a stable and calm mind under every circumstance. This is called equanimity. Jordan Peterson’s mind is a tempest resonating at the lowest frequencies. And he takes dangerous drugs that pushes him from instability into the hell realms. How can someone with this clouded consciousness guide someone else to have a stable mind? Don’t entrust your soul to a fool.

Well, obviously there is such a thing as objective truth, and if you base the truth of a statement on your opinion of speaker, then you're making a big mistake.

There was a meditation guru who requested his students bring him ice cream with walnuts and would convince the men to let him sleep with their wives. Doesn't mean he couldn't meditate to enlightment and see every illusionary layer of the ego.

If a mathematician is an alcoholic but comes up with a theorem, the theorem can be objectively verified as true independent of the condition of the mathematician. But if I am choosing a partner that I will depend on for climbing a mountain, I’m not going to choose someone with an unstable mind, even though he may say some things about mountains that are objectively true.

Rico... Sauve....
02-18-2020 11:32 PM
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questor70 Offline
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Post: #3631
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
I think those who become interested in psychology are often motivated by wanting to treat their own psychological problems and these problems don't necessarily go away just because they get a degree, a practice, and/or a university teaching gig.

I think what people tend to do is reach a plateau where they know exactly what they need to do to get their act together but they don't follow through. This is especially true for over-analytical thinkers. They stay in their own heads and don't put thought to action. I can relate. JP seems to be a person who can formulate action plans and put them into a book but fail to implement them in his own life because he's too busy ruminating and ruminating.

You can say maybe he needs prayer but maybe what he needs is mindfulness/existentialism. After having listened to a lot of his talks, he really does get lost in the gears of his own words, drawing out concepts that could be whittled down to a catchphrase (like, um, clean your room) into long repetitive monologues. This is really par for the course with college professors and it's really not a virtue the way they think it is. Deep truths tend to be compact little nuggets that would fit on fortune cookies. Sure, you can expand them out and explain them, but you don't really HAVE to in order to get the gist.
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2020 12:05 AM by questor70.)
02-19-2020 12:03 AM
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911 Online
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Post: #3632
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
As a harsh critic of JP, I will give him some credit for being publicly redpilled on the global warming scam, he has apparently been taking some heat from the pozzed left for this:



In a way though, that's what the better gatekeepers do, provide some "controversial" truth content into their ideological package.

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02-22-2020 03:00 PM
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Simeon_Strangelight Offline
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Post: #3633
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
It's interesting that he points to the PragerU which is another gatekeeping venue that opposes somewhat feminism, radical leftism, now pokes holes into climate change.

They have to give you some truth or people would leave. PragerU similar to the Jordan will strongly support Jewish, Asian, African, Somali Nationalism but poo-poo any ethnic nationalism for any Western tribe.

At this time - the first gatekeeper question is: "Are you for giving other Western countries the same nationalist right of existence as Israel?" If the answer is no, then you know that the guy is either a useful idiot (Sargon of Akkad) or he is a clear globalist agent (PragerU). Jordan Peterson is somewhere in the middle because I don't think that the guy is deliberately malicious. The liberal indoctrination of the enlightenment has just permeated his brain far more than Sargon's.
02-22-2020 03:55 PM
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Post: #3634
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
Brilliant takedown of JP's 12 Rules by Owen Benjamin earlier this week, this is Big Bear at this best:

https://dlive.tv/p/owenbenjamincomedy+xo3H_SrWR

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03-25-2020 10:08 AM
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Aurini Offline
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Post: #3635
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-25-2020 10:08 AM)911 Wrote:  Brilliant takedown of JP's 12 Rules by Owen Benjamin earlier this week, this is Big Bear at this best:

https://dlive.tv/p/owenbenjamincomedy+xo3H_SrWR

How is this a take down? 12 Rules for Life is decent 'dad pill' advice. To discredit it Benjamin quotes it out of context and distorts the meaning. Then on top of that, he gives voice to salacious rumours bout Peterson. This is vicious and uncharitable; this is the sort of behaviour I expect from LGBT activists, not a self-professed Christian.

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03-26-2020 01:55 PM
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Lazuli Waves Offline
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Post: #3636
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
His daughter posted a video of him on Instagram. I believe this is the first time he's been seen on video since his procedure:

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-XPO_JFXHJ/
03-30-2020 12:45 PM
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Post: #3637
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-26-2020 01:55 PM)Aurini Wrote:  
(03-25-2020 10:08 AM)911 Wrote:  Brilliant takedown of JP's 12 Rules by Owen Benjamin earlier this week, this is Big Bear at this best:

https://dlive.tv/p/owenbenjamincomedy+xo3H_SrWR

How is this a take down? 12 Rules for Life is decent 'dad pill' advice. To discredit it Benjamin quotes it out of context and distorts the meaning. Then on top of that, he gives voice to salacious rumours bout Peterson. This is vicious and uncharitable; this is the sort of behaviour I expect from LGBT activists, not a self-professed Christian.


Granted Benjamin is pretty scathing there, but that doesn't mean he's not right. Peterson's message is at best, inspirational poster-level BS platitudes, and at worse, a gatekeeper's light purple pilled plantation recipe.

The context in which Peterson should be quoted, and where Benjamin is coming from here, is the one that's provided in this video, this is the best and deepest analysis of his persona and methods:





His daughter is fair play here, because the guy who pretends to be a role model for young people is raising a totally broken wayward girl. She's such a total mess that it does raise red flags about her upbringing, she's way beyond normal.

Quote:JP Rule #5: Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them

Young single mom poses in her underwear with her toddler, dates sleazy pornographer... Wonder if JP dislikes that.

Is it mean to point this out? No, not when this guy has been relentlessly promoted and is angling to become the spiritual guru for millions of rudderless young men in search of a father figure. At that point this becomes the duty of guys like Benjamin to tear this charlatan apart.

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03-31-2020 12:56 PM
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Simeon_Strangelight Offline
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Post: #3638
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-30-2020 12:45 PM)Lazuli Waves Wrote:  His daughter posted a video of him on Instagram. I believe this is the first time he's been seen on video since his procedure:

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-XPO_JFXHJ/

He lost weight, looks more miserable than ever, but at least his own-hair-transplants are working well (he had lots of bald spots 10+ years ago).

Served the globalists well - now he is off to play with toys. And he does not look as if he is enjoying anything there.

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03-31-2020 01:01 PM
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Post: #3639
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-30-2020 12:45 PM)Lazuli Waves Wrote:  His daughter posted a video of him on Instagram. I believe this is the first time he's been seen on video since his procedure:

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-XPO_JFXHJ/

This is such a strange video, an old guy driving around a remote control car. Kind of depressing.

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03-31-2020 01:05 PM
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kurtybro Offline
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Post: #3640
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
He ironically vanishes off the face of the earth while the shit he was clamoring against is literally unfolding. Is it a classic cut and run ruse?
(This post was last modified: 03-31-2020 03:04 PM by kurtybro.)
03-31-2020 03:03 PM
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Bitter End Offline
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Post: #3641
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
The old "Peterson dismantled" video was full of out of context stuff and "gotcha" attempts. One can disagree with the man's ideas without losing credibility in the process. It smacked of desperation at the time when I was watching everything that JBP did. I am not gonna go over tens of hours of videos just to argue a very dubious video in first place.

Even now nobody is arguing against his rules per se, just (rather needlessly) attacking him personally for not keeping some of them. I did not expect him to be flawless, one can see that he had enormous trouble as a parent and the stories are well-documented. His whole aura shows a disturbed, but a humble person. Does he like Israel too much? Maybe, but he has given a lot of young men the tools to start thinking and researching for themselves.

I like the man, but unlike Owen Benjamin, I did not look for a daddy online. If it wasn't for the "he is not talking about the jews" angle, Owen would have had nothing to complain about. Now we can speculate who is shilling for whom depending on our sympathies.

I wish the doc well, his life does not seem easy by any means. If somebody gets a rise out of telling us how his daughter is a whore or how he is a junkie, fair enough.
03-31-2020 03:53 PM
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Post: #3642
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-31-2020 03:53 PM)Bitter End Wrote:  ... I did not look for a daddy online. ...

^The difference between leading and being led

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03-31-2020 04:27 PM
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
Sold his soul for shekels and to indulge his intellectualized wank.

A disheveled drug addled man with a dysfunctional family. The kosher approved ‘red-pill’

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03-31-2020 05:19 PM
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monsquid Offline
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Post: #3644
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
Fact that he is hiding out in Russia of all places is very disappointing.
03-31-2020 06:10 PM
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CynicalContrarian Offline
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Post: #3645
RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
At his age.
Is Peterson strong enough to survive the China virus...?
03-31-2020 06:12 PM
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
(03-31-2020 06:10 PM)monsquid Wrote:  Fact that he is hiding out in Russia of all places is very disappointing.

Why ? I enjoyed my time in russia more than my time in the us.
04-01-2020 04:50 AM
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ScannerLIV Offline
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
And just how long did you spent time there? Did you even live there long term.

Sure, if you can handle the depressing weather and decaying infrastructure with bare amenities (outside Moscow and st. Petersburg that covers at least 90 percent of Russia), and the overwhelming, pervading atmospheric menace seemingly looming in the air-and grumpy people year round-you're more Russian than I am.
04-01-2020 06:00 AM
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
Come on, stop it now you make me want to go back Smile
04-01-2020 07:05 AM
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crutoy Offline
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
like should have found another platform for video content. This type of nonsense was always on the cards./
04-01-2020 10:23 AM
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RE: The Jordan Peterson thread
I was one of the early one calling him out, 911, for his "Individualism for White People" schtick; yes, he fell into the machine, but vicious bullying is not the right way.

Rumour has it that he may be coming to God. He's rejected him all his life - and the pained look on his face reminds me of somebody who's starting to realize what a fool they've been all these years (I see it in the mirror fairly often). Regardless, he's been through a rough medical period - he's very skinny - I'm not going to join a mob piling on the guy when he's at his weakest.

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04-01-2020 12:15 PM
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